January 30, 2012
Where To Find Readers Post #1
6:00 AM | 
Posted by
C.J. Ellisson |
Thanks so much for the tweets, the FB comments, and the blog comments on this new venture. I've been excited for a while to cover this topic, but I've always felt overwhelmed on exactly where to start.
Disclaimer: Everything is these posts is my opinion based on my own experiences and observations. You may discover something different when you try an avenue -- as in life, we will each have different journeys, even while on the same path.
If you're new and would like to read why I'm doing this or who in the hell I think I am to give advice to anybody, please read last week's post.
Let's start off with places I have spent a lot of time time around the Internet the past three years and whether or not I felt they were worth the hours I poured in. I'll rate them on a one to ten scale of effectiveness. Worst being posted first:
Authonomy.com: A site where you post your work and get votes from within the community to move you work up to the possible eyes of a Harper Collins editor. Huge time suck and a lot of writers competing for spots, not many actual readers that I could see.
I spent a little over a month trying to get involved and realized soon that even if I got some honest advice and feedback on my work, it was not worth the effort or time. There is a rumor that editors lurk from other publishing houses and might contact you. I can vouch this is true. I did have the COO of the largest erotica publisher in the nation contact me through my seven chapter excerpt up for public viewing on Authonomy.
Site rating for building a reader base: 4.5 (mainly because of the email I got from that COO)
Writing.com: A site that is so large you need a mentor to show you around and explain how things work. Which I did. I made some excellent connections with other writers, received some horrible feedback from people who can barely type in text speak, and got some honest-to-goodness real feedback that helped improve my work.
Once I realized this wasn't the best spot to find deep critiques, I started to use it as a beta reader service. I spent a little bit of money and got eyes on my work and honest (albeit occasionally scathing) comments by awarding "gift points" to reviewers.
When my book was actually published and up for sale, some of these reviewers took the time to go off of the site and post reviews for me on Amazon, B&N, and Goodreads in exchange for letting them read my whole polished MS for free. I made some terrific connections on the site and even though I'm not currently active, I've remained connected to these writers through Twitter and Facebook.
Site rating for building a reader base: 5.5
Fanfiction.net: Obviously, you can't post your published work here. But this site is made up of a HUGE audience of readers -- readers who value the written word and the stories they've experienced enough to want to continue those beloved stories in new adventures. Adventures they create and share with other fans of the show/movie/series… whatever. I've even met an author or two or got their start in professional writing on FF. Don't knock it. If you have the time to write some short Twilight, Star Wars, or General Hospital snippet in your own voice you could have thousands of fans on there reading your professionally written work in a matter of days.
Site rating for building a reader base: 6
Twitter: Ah… I know I'm going to piss a few people off here. Especially the ones who found this blog post via a tweet. I haven't spent a lot of time trying to build a following on Twitter, nor do I utilize it the same way I do Facebook, so my opinion will be biased.
It's real easy for me to find my peers, industry professionals, and even the ever-valuable book blogger on Twitter, but how do I actually connect with real readers? You know, the ones who don't blog (which is like 99% of them)?
I'm not a celebrity, I don't have a recognizable name, nor do I have a platform that puts me into the public eye. I know a TON of people (I'm pretty much a gabby-gus), and yet 90% of the people I've met do not use Twitter. Sure, they may have checked it out when it first launched and got an account, but they don't really use it on a day-to-day basis. If they do "use it" it's keep keep up with the famous people the like.
I did a smarmy post about Facebook spanking Twitter's ass a few weeks ago, and I still firmly believe it is not where I will meet readers and interact with them. It's too fast, too "right now" and not personable. It's great for delivering news and important stuff, but my work and myself don't fall into that category, and neither do most small business people in the world. Nothing I have to say is life changing, and I think what Twitter does best is getting info out at once to whomever is looking at their stream RIGHT NOW.
Regular people follow things that interest them, like news agencies, celebrities, sports personalities…I could go on and on, but my point is, they don't follow someone in their neighborhood or a small time blogger like me. Hey, the truth hurts, I know.
Has Twitter helped me reach may target audience with my books? No. Has it helped me reach writers who will visit this blog to read my advice on reaching real readers? Absolutely!
Site rating for building a reader base: 7 (mostly dependent on if you can reach your target audience)
I'm sure you can guess where I'm going with this next bit… You can see the writing on the wall, yes? ;-)
The number one place to build an actual reader base you can interact with is Facebook, which I'll rate a 8.75, because it's not perfect and it takes a lot of time to master.
It's literally filled with regular readers -- readers who never visit blogs, never tweet, never read a novel on their phone one line at a time, never visit a specialized site to read free books from writers they've never heard of, and never visit the forums of any retailer.
This one place will provide you with what you need to build a reader base -- but you won't be able to do it simply by logging on and posting once a day. Nope, way more work is involved.
Please tune in next week when I break down the ways to meet readers on Facebook and the dos and don'ts as you embark on your journey to find more readers.
Have you tried a site I didn't list here? Please share! We all need to know which ones work and which ones don't so we can utilize our valuable time properly.
Until next week, try to spend almost equal time on writing new work as you do reading. Mr. King said it best:
Want to keep this course free and have me do all parts (beginner, intermediate and advanced) here on this blog rather than I create a big fancy website and start charging? Please consider leaving a donation -- thanks!
Disclaimer: Everything is these posts is my opinion based on my own experiences and observations. You may discover something different when you try an avenue -- as in life, we will each have different journeys, even while on the same path.
If you're new and would like to read why I'm doing this or who in the hell I think I am to give advice to anybody, please read last week's post.
Let's start off with places I have spent a lot of time time around the Internet the past three years and whether or not I felt they were worth the hours I poured in. I'll rate them on a one to ten scale of effectiveness. Worst being posted first:
AbsoluteWrite.com: I'm pointing this out because a LOT of writers spend time on this site, using it like a virtual watercooler to hang around an gab with other writers, not because AW actually claims to help you gain exposure as an author. It's a great resource to find instant feedback about a peer's experience with a publisher, an agent, or an editor, but beware. Spending time here might make you feel connected but it will not gain you a reader base, nor will it increase your word count on your latest WiP. Get what you need and get out. Don't use it to socialize or you will lose hours in your day and get nowhere in your career.
Hey, if you've learned something different and there is a hidden stash of writers who have magically become your devoted readers, then please let me know and I'll try it.
This site, just like many other terrific author sites, like savvyauthors.com, never claim to help you find a reader base. I pointed them out because what they do take up is valuable time in your day, a day you should be devoting to the two main things in your career: writing and building you reader base.
Site rating for building a reader base: 0
Yahoo News Groups: Also, not so lovingly, called yahoo loops. I was torn on whether to include this one. I did because I'm betting most of you are in at least one. And if it's large, it eats up a lot of time sifting through the advice, sarcasm, promo, and personal minutia to find a shred of anything helpful.
Tally up the time you spend on them daily, then weekly and monthy to get your total time involved in these loops. Then determine how many actual readers you've met. Then divide the two to find out the time cost. How much could you be writing if you weren't in that loop? How many lost words did those one or two readers cost you? Oh, and be honest, don't count the "readers" who are your peers. Those people are super sweet and you can call them your friends, but they are not your target audience.
Tally up the time you spend on them daily, then weekly and monthy to get your total time involved in these loops. Then determine how many actual readers you've met. Then divide the two to find out the time cost. How much could you be writing if you weren't in that loop? How many lost words did those one or two readers cost you? Oh, and be honest, don't count the "readers" who are your peers. Those people are super sweet and you can call them your friends, but they are not your target audience.
Peer connections are terrific, don't get me wrong, but not until I dropped out of every writing guild I was in, every sub-chapter, and every damn yahoo loop did I start to sell my books. Stop networking and start thinking about how to reach real people. Pull yourself out of the Internet bubble of the writing industry. Your time each day is limited, Don't waste it where you can't interact with readers.
Site rating for building a reader base: .5
Author's Den: Sounds cool, right? A place to hang out and drink heavily in a wood-paneled room with muted lighting? Okay, well, that's not the case. It's a site geared toward promoting authors, they let you have a page and include a bio and some work. But I never had anyone contact me and say they saw my profile on Author's Den or that they discovered my work that way. The only plus point is it's free.
Site rating for building a reader base: 1
Textnovel.com: I joined this site in 2009 a few months after I started writing. You needed an actual reader base to do well and have your book make it to the top during a contest, similar to Authonomy (see below), but in an entirely different way. The premise for Textnovel was to duplicate the Japanese texting craze that landed people book deals based on texting lines of their stories out to interested followers.
This site is run by an agent and he sometimes takes on "winners" as clients (my book was too racy for him even though it won fan favorite and editor's choice). The first textnovel winner won with a YA book and landed a NY book deal for the author -- YAY! Good for her. The second contest had two co-winners and the one I know personally didn't land a deal, even though she did get an agent. I jumped in and got involved with textnovel because I already had supporters for my work who could "vote" my story up the charts, otherwise I never would have had a chance.
In the contest I was in, the third big one textnovel had run at the time, I placed second. No book deal. No agent. Made some industry contacts and made a few enemies out of my peers as well. C'est la vie, water under the bridge now. Months poured into this contest and a huge amount of emotional attachment. It was a major roller-coaster ride. All of which did nothing for my career, nor did it gain me many readers. My work is still up there for exposure, but it rarely gets any comments nor have I ever had anyone contact me that they found my work on Textnovel.
Site rating for building a reader base: 2
Library Thing: This site is similar to Goodreads, but much more in depth. I read that publishers think this is a better site to have a presence on, but it looks to me like it's geared more toward big names making a splash in their community than small nobodies like me. I'd say it's worth it check out, and perhaps my own lack of knowledge on the site is due my inability to spend months navigating all they have to offer.
Out of the dozens of bloggers and reviewers I've made contact with, only TWO crossed over and posted a review there. This site almost seems to be used as more of a cataloging of a reader's personal library than a social networking tool like Goodreads.
Site rating for building a reader base: 2
Scribd: A place where you can put parts, or all, of your work up via multiple document formats and hope for the best. I originally had my work up here for one month back in Oct '09 and didn't get much response. I took it down soon after, I'm not even sure exactly when. I'd had 539 "reads" and 32 people "following" my work. But looking back on my old account I can't find any other data. I never had anyone contact me and say they read my work on Scribd, as I did with writing.com.
As an experiment, I've uploaded my work there on Jan 23rd and here are the stats in one week:
As an experiment, I've uploaded my work there on Jan 23rd and here are the stats in one week:
Just One Taste: A free short story containing half of Vampire Vacation tacked on for free. 83 Reads.
Another Sip: Half of book two, The Hunt, offered as a free read. 74 Reads.
Worth it? Don't know. This one is hard to judge. I've started using the Scribd site account again via Involver on Facebook a few months ago. I use it in its app form to upload free PDFs for download direct from my FB page.
What, did that last bit lose you? I'll explain that later, grasshopper. ;-) We need to cover the basics before I bombard you with app suggestions.
What, did that last bit lose you? I'll explain that later, grasshopper. ;-) We need to cover the basics before I bombard you with app suggestions.
Site rating for building a reader base: 3 or 4? Totally have no clue on this one.
Amazon Community Forums: Amazon has recently changed their forums, and with good reason. Lots of authors were spamming the forums and the readers who use the system to converse with other readers were way pissed, as well they should be. I started to get my toes wet in the forums back in the fall of 2010, but stuck to mostly writer groups and author friendly groups.
I made some excellent connections with other peers and even joined a paranormal group that I interact with largely now on FB. It claims to be a mix of readers and writers, but I'd say it's more reviewers, authors and a few industry professionals like editors (the first and the latter definitely are "readers", but they are not your average reader, more of a highly active one with ties to the industry).
I avoid these forums on Amazon now like the plague. I've read recently that authors do well with establishing their own community forums attached to their book's Amazon listing, and I may try that. But I have no plans to head back into the forums after I've seen some really angry people treat authors like we're the scum of the earth for attempting to interact with readers on there.
Site rating for building a reader base: 3
Wattpad.com: I joined in July 2010, before my book was published, and then posted a nine chapter excerpt in Dec 2010 after its release. Stats are as follows:
972 reads
8 stars
3 comments
Did anyone buy the book after reading the excerpt? I have no idea, and no way of finding out. Did anyone ever contact me and say they found me on Wattpad? Nope. Still better stats than Scribd.
Site rating for building a reader base: 4
Authonomy.com: A site where you post your work and get votes from within the community to move you work up to the possible eyes of a Harper Collins editor. Huge time suck and a lot of writers competing for spots, not many actual readers that I could see.
I spent a little over a month trying to get involved and realized soon that even if I got some honest advice and feedback on my work, it was not worth the effort or time. There is a rumor that editors lurk from other publishing houses and might contact you. I can vouch this is true. I did have the COO of the largest erotica publisher in the nation contact me through my seven chapter excerpt up for public viewing on Authonomy.
Site rating for building a reader base: 4.5 (mainly because of the email I got from that COO)
Goodreads.com: Originally I used Goodreads to list my book in December 2009 a few months before I planned to self-pub it in early 2010. I landed an agent in March 2010 and tried to take the listing down. Unfortunately for me, a few beta readers from FB posted good reviews (and a few supporters from my fellow contestant in the Textnovel contest posted some bad ones) and the Goodreads folk said once the book hit the magic number of ten reviews they wouldn't remove the listing.
Did a Goodreads listing with mixed opinions on my book hinder NY Publishers from looking at my MS? No, in the end, they couldn't have cared less, I was the one frantic over it. Newbies really do panic about the smallest things, and I was one of them.
So, good and bad, those reviews stayed up and when my book finally was published over seven months later they were still there. I used Goodreads for a contest to distribute print copies of my work when it first released. It cost me a lot in product and in shipping and I don't think it gained me much in the form of reviews or gaining readers.
One person, out of 900 who requested a book, I knew through the paranormal group I mentioned before from Amazon. I was thrilled she got one of the few copies. My connection with her was probably the only good thing that came out of all the money spent.
One person, out of 900 who requested a book, I knew through the paranormal group I mentioned before from Amazon. I was thrilled she got one of the few copies. My connection with her was probably the only good thing that came out of all the money spent.
The GR forums seem much more author friendly and as long as you approach them well, read the group rules, and remember your manners to not talk about yourself or your book unless asked, then I think its a great spot to mingle with much nicer readers than Amazon. The time commitment is greater than I can offer right now, but I think I might try it again in the future. Especially if they allowed authors to giveaway ebooks as prizes.
Site rating for building a reader base: 5
Writing.com: A site that is so large you need a mentor to show you around and explain how things work. Which I did. I made some excellent connections with other writers, received some horrible feedback from people who can barely type in text speak, and got some honest-to-goodness real feedback that helped improve my work.
Once I realized this wasn't the best spot to find deep critiques, I started to use it as a beta reader service. I spent a little bit of money and got eyes on my work and honest (albeit occasionally scathing) comments by awarding "gift points" to reviewers.
When my book was actually published and up for sale, some of these reviewers took the time to go off of the site and post reviews for me on Amazon, B&N, and Goodreads in exchange for letting them read my whole polished MS for free. I made some terrific connections on the site and even though I'm not currently active, I've remained connected to these writers through Twitter and Facebook.
Site rating for building a reader base: 5.5
Fanfiction.net: Obviously, you can't post your published work here. But this site is made up of a HUGE audience of readers -- readers who value the written word and the stories they've experienced enough to want to continue those beloved stories in new adventures. Adventures they create and share with other fans of the show/movie/series… whatever. I've even met an author or two or got their start in professional writing on FF. Don't knock it. If you have the time to write some short Twilight, Star Wars, or General Hospital snippet in your own voice you could have thousands of fans on there reading your professionally written work in a matter of days.
Site rating for building a reader base: 6
Twitter: Ah… I know I'm going to piss a few people off here. Especially the ones who found this blog post via a tweet. I haven't spent a lot of time trying to build a following on Twitter, nor do I utilize it the same way I do Facebook, so my opinion will be biased.
It's real easy for me to find my peers, industry professionals, and even the ever-valuable book blogger on Twitter, but how do I actually connect with real readers? You know, the ones who don't blog (which is like 99% of them)?
I'm not a celebrity, I don't have a recognizable name, nor do I have a platform that puts me into the public eye. I know a TON of people (I'm pretty much a gabby-gus), and yet 90% of the people I've met do not use Twitter. Sure, they may have checked it out when it first launched and got an account, but they don't really use it on a day-to-day basis. If they do "use it" it's keep keep up with the famous people the like.
I did a smarmy post about Facebook spanking Twitter's ass a few weeks ago, and I still firmly believe it is not where I will meet readers and interact with them. It's too fast, too "right now" and not personable. It's great for delivering news and important stuff, but my work and myself don't fall into that category, and neither do most small business people in the world. Nothing I have to say is life changing, and I think what Twitter does best is getting info out at once to whomever is looking at their stream RIGHT NOW.
Regular people follow things that interest them, like news agencies, celebrities, sports personalities…I could go on and on, but my point is, they don't follow someone in their neighborhood or a small time blogger like me. Hey, the truth hurts, I know.
Has Twitter helped me reach may target audience with my books? No. Has it helped me reach writers who will visit this blog to read my advice on reaching real readers? Absolutely!
Site rating for building a reader base: 7 (mostly dependent on if you can reach your target audience)
I'm sure you can guess where I'm going with this next bit… You can see the writing on the wall, yes? ;-)
The number one place to build an actual reader base you can interact with is Facebook, which I'll rate a 8.75, because it's not perfect and it takes a lot of time to master.
It's literally filled with regular readers -- readers who never visit blogs, never tweet, never read a novel on their phone one line at a time, never visit a specialized site to read free books from writers they've never heard of, and never visit the forums of any retailer.
This one place will provide you with what you need to build a reader base -- but you won't be able to do it simply by logging on and posting once a day. Nope, way more work is involved.
Please tune in next week when I break down the ways to meet readers on Facebook and the dos and don'ts as you embark on your journey to find more readers.
Have you tried a site I didn't list here? Please share! We all need to know which ones work and which ones don't so we can utilize our valuable time properly.
Until next week, try to spend almost equal time on writing new work as you do reading. Mr. King said it best:
"If you want to be a writer, you must do two things above all others: read a lot and write a lot…reading is the creative center of a writer’s life…you cannot hope to sweep someone else away by the force of your writing until it has been done to you."
Want to keep this course free and have me do all parts (beginner, intermediate and advanced) here on this blog rather than I create a big fancy website and start charging? Please consider leaving a donation -- thanks!
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16 comments:
Thanks for this C.J. At this point in my career, I find this post very fascinating. Will definitely be back to see what you have to say about facebook :)
This was a great rundown. Thanks CJ.
C.J., my experience with the networks you listed is exactly the same. I've met fabulous readers authors, agents, and editors on all of them and made some great friends in the industry that followed me over into Facebook - but I've met ZERO "Jane Smiths, normal person who likes to read".
Facebook is the ONLY social network I know of where normal people hang out and connect. Because normal people have a life and are not trying to sell you something online and have more important things to do than hang out on GoodReads or Shelfari.
And I agree, more time should be spent on writing, especially for someone like me who is still trying to create a back-list.
Great summary of supposed promotional sites. I've tried almost all of these and dropped off many at the top of your list. I agree, with the exception of Goodreads. That site does take a lot of time, but the folks I interact with in groups there seldom include any of the authors I know. Goodreads is much more reader-based. However, it takes time (not per day, but over months) to interact as a reader when I'm primarily a writer. I participate in 1-2 Goodreads book club discussions per month, which helps me make reading a priority, which otherwise slips away from me. Coupling that interaction with something I need and want to improve does help me with two goals.
I have lots of success in FB groups. For the time invested, the returns are much greater.
You're welcome, Susan and Angie! After I tell people next week why I think FB is the best place to reach readers, I'll start to explain what you do to meet them, build relationships, and grow an interested reader base.
J.D. - LOL! I knew I'd be preaching to choir with a lot of this data, glad to see I'm not alone in my results on all these sites. Hey, a few good things came out of my time at WDC -- and you're one of them.
Marsha - thank you for your feedback, especially regarding GR. I've wondered if I should spend more time forming relationships in some nook club groups, but again, the time commitment is huge.
You've covered a lot of ground here, offered some interesting observations and given sound advice. I look forward to your post next week when you break down how to meet readers on Facebook. I am slowly building my author page and would like to learn how to attract more readers to the site. (I do enjoy my time on Twitter!)
I feel like you are re-iterating things I've been saying for a while with a little more site listing! I've had the same experiences and received attitude lashings when I complained that I wanted to actually connect with readers. You hit the right notes on the right sites and have come up with the same experience many of us had. I actually think I've had at least one reader buy my books from Twitter and a few from FB. I'm not that socially inclined and FB, while I love it, doesn't really appeal to me since I don't like posting or reading people's or my personal daily routines...Hopefully you can help us sift through the millions of our numbers to jump to the top (or even middle) of the heap in the next installment.
A genuinely helpful post, C.J. I'm looking forward to your next one.
As someone new to e-publishing, this concentration on marketing through social media seems marginally insane.
I know I will have to do it but I can't say I'm looking forward to it. It's a little like going back to an old girlfriend you never really liked and who won't stop talking.
Ah well, maybe she's changed.
Fascinating and helpful, thank you.
Whatever you do, if it's going to help, you ahve to genuinely like taking part in that forum or group - I joined a lot of sites to start with but have mainly settled with twitter, FB and goodreads, because I enjoy chatting here and it shows.
Thanks for sharing, C.J. I look forward to seeing what you have planned next week. Have a great week.
-Jimmy
Really, really helpful C.J.. Thanks for posting. I'm still in the early stages of all this stuff and trying desperately to make sure it doesn't swamp my writing. Twitter is pretty new to me (I found this site through a tweet!), still finding it confusing and time consuming. I've been using FB for social networking for three years and have a page for my writing. But I'm clearly not doing what I should be doing and I'm now going back to have a closer look. Thanks for the motivation!
Love this! Can't wait for more. It's sooooo nice to hear real words from someone who has been there and done that.
Naomi Bellina
Gail - Nice to hear from you and thank you for commenting! There is so much information to cover on FB that after I tell people where I found readers I then plan to break down the how.
P.I. - I knew I couldn't be alone in these findings, thanks! And no, you're not off base in your thoughts. I received attitude from peers as well when I wanted to break away from the mold. Thanks for commenting and hope to see you back over the next few weeks.
J.D. - Love your analogy! I kind of feel that way about Twitter, and yet, most of you probably found your way to me here through that tool. It's a really fine balance, just like in our work. Think of the skill it takes to weave showing and telling into an action scene to really make it come alive. I never understood those people who always trashed others for "telling" instead of "showing" a good book is a balance of the two, with neither overwhelming the reader. It's impossible to relay every single detail through showing or your book would be weighed down by minutia.
Think of social networking the same way, you need to weed out the minutia and focus on what really matters -- building a connection with readers through small, occasional interactions.
Grace- excellent point I intend to emphasize later. You have to be genuine in your interest and pursuits or it will appear hollow and fake. Never good and never a combination for success. Thanks for commenting!
Jimmy - Love you, man, thanks for your continued support. See you next week!
Stuart - Thanks for stopping by Stuart, I'm thrilled to hear you found me on Twitter. I figured that would be the case. I'll be explaining over a series how to interact on FB. The topic is too large to cover in one post.
Naomi - Thank for commenting and stopping by! Yup, you'll hear lots and lots of stuff I've done already. My sincere hope is it will save some of you lots of time!
CJ, Is there a sight where I can post a chapter or two of my novel and get a review? Im not published or anything, but looking to get a third opinion.
RhynoVampire - Thanks for stopping by! Yes, I'd suggest writing.com I mention it above in my post. Wishing you he best with it!
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